Ce-ar fi sa demolam cat mai repede UE?

Ce-ar fi să demolăm cât mai repede UE ? – 19 ianuarie 2016

 

Stefan Kovacs

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Evenimentele din perioada 2008- 2015 ne arată că UE- începută ca o idee bună- a devenit un mare fâs. Dacă cheia de boltă a acestei construcții este austeritatea+madam Merkel- mai bine nu. Modul în care Merkeloaia s-a comportat cu un stat suveran- Grecia- precum și murdăria majorității restului de state Europene dezvoltate la dresa Greciei ne-au arătat că UE nu este despre construcție și dezvoltare ci despre înapoiere economică în favoarea unor state prădător. Figurile cu imigranții ne-au arătat că pentru Germania (ca și pentru restul PPE) nu există Europeni - ci doar sclavi pe tarla- plus o groază de năvălitori barbari gata să fie folosiți când trebuie și unde trebuie pentru a închide gura lumii.
Ca să rezumăm:
1. Europa civilizată trebuie să se reîntoarcă la principiile de bază ale civilizației Europene așa cum o știm- respectiv la principiile iudeo-creștine. 
2. Vrăjelile despre "sharing" și alte aiureli "corecte politic" să le facă madam Merkel și apropiații domniei sale acăsică la ei. Într-o lume normală ceea ce a făcut dna. Merkel din vara lui 2015 încoace ar fi condus la ocuparea militară a Germaniei pe termen nelimitat. Există în primul rând locuitorii Europei- după care mai vedem. N-avem absolut nici un fel de datorie față de musulmani. 
3. Evoluția României din 2007 încoace- de când suntem în UE- a fost de la mai prost în sus. Banii aruncați ca pomană prin fondurile europene s-au dus la clienții PPE- respectiv PDL și UDMR- fără să existe nici un fel de avantaj pentru România. 
4. Ținutul în lesă cu Schengen-ul- pe motive de MCV- e încă o dovadă că nu există democrație în construcția UE. Dl. Ivanciuc a spus-o într-o seară foarte clar- problema țigănească ne va ține departe de Schengen forever. Iar UE e corectă din punct de vedere politic și nu vrea să rezolve această problemă- pur și simplu prin interzicerea accesului asocialilor în spațiul UE/Schengen. 
5. Speranțe nu prea sunt. Vrăjelile cu agenda Lisabona s-au dovedit un mare fâs. Europa anului 2015 e mai săracă și mai puțin dezvoltată decât Europa anului 1990. Și nici nu există alte intenții în afară de desființarea statelor naționale și preluarea super-controlului de către o birocrație super-centralizată a cărei "calitate profesională" o vedem perfect în guvernul Cioloș .

Ce e de făcut ?
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Simplu. SĂ păstrăm din UE ceea ce a fost bun- respectiv desființarea vizelor și eventual Euro-ul. Să obligăm orice fel de construcție UE să pună pe primul- și singurul plan- dezvoltarea asistată a TUTUROR statelor din UE- cel puțin la nivelul unei Spanii. 
Să desființăm pentru totdeauna orice se dorește a fi ANTICREȘTIN, SUPERNAȚIONAL și care urmărește să ne ia banii din buzunar în virtutea unor scopuri "de solidaritate" cu niște popoare față de care nu avem nici un fel de datorie și de obligație.

 

Preda Mihailescu Incepem! Singura problema va fi sa ii convingem sa ne spuna cinstit ca doresc sa fie anticrestini - ai naibii, se cam ascund! 

 

Stefan Kovacs Nu țin neapărat să spună- dar normal ar fi să protejeze civilizația creștină și nu diversele musulmanisme. Atunci când nu mai ai voie să afișezi niște simboluri de genul Moș Crăciun- s-a cam terminat cu tot ce înseamnă civilizație. Idem când dai voie tuturor imamilor să te atace în mod direct.

 

Prospectiv A-z  Cred ca va inteleg matricea de reactii, dar vad niste probleme. Am sa le iau pe rand:

1 & 2) Acestea cred ca-s miscari ale elitei pentru tranzitionarea lumii din actuala Criza spre epoca post-nationala/ideologica. Citate in acest sens ale celor care trec drept membri ai acestei elite tot isi scot capul in circulatie, cel putin dela Criza cealalta, cca 100 ani in urma. Cum repeta unul acum cativa ani, 'Never let a Crisis go to waste!'

Omul postmodern, acela cu adevarat nou pe care atatea sisteme s-au chinuit sa-l cace, este vesticul prin excelenta, slavit de toate claxoanele timpului. Acesta aproape ca invita tratamentul pe care elitele par ca ni-l pregatesc. 

3) Nu cred ca Romania a intrat in Cluburi pentru alt motiv decat acela de a-si castiga (citeste, cumpara) timp. Timpul Romaniei post-Ceausescu a reusit sa fie extins, cu ceva noroc si romani de isprava in locuri potrivite, intrarea unipolarismului in alta zodie si biruri grele. Daca a meritat sau nu o va spune fiecare, desi tot eu spun ca Romania merita exact atat cat suntem dispusi sa platim pentru ea.

4 & 5) Schengen/MCV nu cred ca-s decat simptomele la vedere ale integrarii Romaniei in UE cu asterisc. De aceasta 'integrare' ii fac responsabili pe Basescu si eventual Nastase. Ma intreb daca experienta acestor doua 'integrari', ale Romaniei si Bulgariei, n-au reconfirmat mai vechiul gust al vest-europenilor pentru colonialismul impotriva aproapelui european (vezi descrierea nazismului facuta in acesti termeni de Mark Mazower). 

Desigur, Grecia si alte 'bagatele sudice' sunt luate la aceeasi destinatie ca Romania si Bulgaria, doar ca pe alta cale. Dificultatea acum este a unui hocus-pocus formal.

Domnule Kovacs, EUropa s-a facut initial intre oarecum egali, pentru a stabiliza continentul. Cuvantul cheie este quasi-omogenitate culturala/economica/istorica/etc. Prosperitatea ce a urmat a fost prezentata ca exemplu/model de neoliberalism, cand lucrurile n-au stat chiar asa--si acum observam cata miscare legislativa e necesara pentru a 'reduce frictiunea'. Desigur, totul in numele omogenizarii legislative ca premiza pentru cresterea armonizarii. Problema gravissima este ca multe din aceste masuri taie sansele celor mici si adaugati mai pe urma de a se armoniza economic cu cei dintai. 

Mai mult, daca ganditi ca EUro este elementul la care n-ati renunta (desi acesta e cam SF pentru Romania) dintr-o constructie EUropeana acceptabila, ganditi-va mai intai la o solutie pentru lipsa de omogenitate. Elitele par a avea aceasta solutie pregatita in plic: omul post-national/ideologic etc.

 

Stefan Kovacs Stimate Prospectiv A-z - eu sunt un om practic. Nu mă omoară atât elitele- cât lipsa de progres pentru binele meu personal- și implicit pentru binele nostru. Am avut mari probleme legate de obținerea primei mele vize- în Germania - și de-atunci am o înclinare către granițele deschise. De-asemenea, mi s-ar părea normal să faci un share- dacă chiar te interesează- cu educația și implicit dezvoltarea pe parte tehnică- și am fost relativ uimit să constat că nu suntem noi ăia doriții prin institutele și universitățile lor- ci dragii de turci (mă refer aici tot la Germania). Cât despre Euro- în perioada pre-Euro era o problemă cu diversele valute- țin minte că la greci existau case de schimb cu texte în limba greacă- evident- și te fraiereau chiar în centrul Atenei iar la olandezi am ajuns într-o duminică dupăamiază când toate erau închise- așa că mărcile pe care le aveam la noi s-au dovedit cam inutile. Nu văd omogenitatea decât prin educație și dezvoltare.

 

Prospectiv A-z  Omul practic pe care-l definiti de fapt este foarte real si peste tot intalnit. Numai ca parafrazand un economist o sa spun ca orice om practic calca in umbra unei teorii necunoscute/'defuncte'. Teoriile astea sunt puse in circulatie de elite, de la un nivel ele determina totusi binele si greul de felul celor ilustrate de dvs. 

S-o spun pe sleau: Vrem EUro si granite deschise, va trebui sa acceptam si cele care acum ni se par de neinghitit. Noi, romanii de-o varsta, avem o problema aditionala, transformarea noastra a inceput tarziu si s-a terminat prea devreme.

 

Prospectiv A-z   Daca mi-e permis, am sa elaborez un pic raspunsul de mai sus, in caz ca taie orice speranta a omului obisnuit/practic/etc. In cazul romanilor, solutia la problemele de mai sus ar veni dela aplicarea elitelor romanesti in sensul rezolvarii problemelor atat generale cat si specific romanesti. 

Relatia {elita romaneasca <--> popor roman} este periodic viciata, iar noi traim in cel mai recent val, mai cu seama dela Basism incoace. Vreunul mai destept se va uita si la aceasta relatie si mecanismele de transformare/modernizare ale acesteia, dela cronicari incoace. Sper sa n-o faca precum Boia, plecand dela concluzie.

 

Smaranda Dobrescu In acest moment Uniunea pare sa fi incetat a fi o solutie economica a tarilor europene ci mai degraba o problema. Indiferent daca contextul ii va obliga pe liderii UE sa ia hotarari majore in privinta marilor probleme ce preseaza azi Continentul, probabil ca scadenta parafarii TTIP va veni. Sigur ca aparent ideea nu are legatura cu cele dezbatute mai sus, dar mi se pare important daca aceasta situatie nu va deveni o constrangere suplimentara. Inca nu sunt edificata daca TTIP-ul trebuie acceptat de fiecare tara in parte saui doar de reprezentantii vreunei institutii UE.Parafarea individuala de catre tari ar reprezenta o piatra de moara de gatul tarilor semnatare, fortate de un element nou sa ramana in formatie respectand niste conditii nu neaparat optime..

Prospectiv A-z  http://www.cotidianul.ro/reuters-mai-avem-timp-pana-in.../
&
http://www.cotidianul.ro/nu-vom-putea-evita-inchiderea.../

 

 

Reuters: "Mai avem timp până în martie, poate până la vară. După aceea,…

COTIDIANUL.RO

 

Prospectiv A-z  Din cate pot sa-mi dau seama, UE a fost, si a ramas in linii mari, un proiect sponsorat de *necesitatea* de a putea suna Europa la un singur numar de telefon. 

In momentul in care cateva natii EUropene gandindu-se la oportunitatile lumii multipolare pentru a reevalua neajunsurile capitalismului de casino, sponsorul nu poate ramane indiferent. 

BREXIT-ul e doar una din parghiile ce vor fi actionate. Perfuzia fortata e alta. TTIPul mentionat mai sus e inca una.

Va rezista UE? Ce se va alege din UE 2.0? Ce sansa ar avea Romania? Se pare ca avem ce prospectiva.

 

Mihai Ion Turcu Legat de variile "to do list" din UE si SUA Romania s-a sacrificat industria, bancile,propriile relatii comerciale, a pierdut piata interna cu amanuntul, a instrainat pamant, a cedat resurse si a pierdut populatie tanara si calificata. A folosit prea putin din fondurile de aderare la dispozitie ( in teorie).Coruptia a inflorit conex acestor "to do list" si potentialului financiar al corupatorilor. Mai avem control asupra leului prin BNR si echilibrului macroeconomic ( se spune personal nu inteleg mare lucru din finante).A pierdut capacitatea de aparare nationala si lichefiaza ideea de natiune si stat national.Xred ca decat in cercul exterior ( Hintergarten) al Olandei, preferabil este un ROexist fiind tocmai ajunsti in pielea goala. Romania a pierdut un razboi nearmat.

 

Prospectiv A-z   Pe de-o parte, aflam ca: 
"But at the same time, the British have often made the Continental Europeans more cosmopolitan, more economically liberal and more invested in the trans-Atlantic bond. A Brexit would knock the EU's finely balanced power structures off kilter. Without the British and their advocacy for free trade, the influence of southern European countries would become greater and that of Germany, the Netherlands and Finland would wane.

Furthermore, the heft and influence of the EU would be weakened in the globalized world economy. In the event of a Brexit, the union would have 13 percent fewer residents and its economic power would be reduced by 17 percent. Without London, the EU would be robbed of its only global financial capital outside of Frankfurt. "If we want to play a global role when it comes to development aid, environmental protection or security policy, then we need the British," says European Parliament President Martin Schulz."

Pe de alta:
Brexit
antoine 01/05/2016
I think there would be several benefits from Brexit: - EU to look at more integration and more win win solutions rather than exclusive destructive self interest - More simplification rather than having to involve national parliament on top of executive/governmentl administrations - Rebalancing power between Northern and Southern Europe to try and avoid the otherwise inevitable collapse of the EU brought by dominant Northern Europe (see Greece...) although, of course, this will not be sufficient - Encourage other self centered countries to also leave ensuring the countries keener on actually building Europe are less prevented from progressing The current strategy of giving UK what it asks for is a sure recipe for the collapse of Europe. Of course, Brexit will not garantee success but will make much needed remedial actions easier.

EU difficulties greater than you think.
idbeckett 01/05/2016
There is little public trust in the UK for the EU. We have seen too many cases of promises made and solid deals made simply to discover that when push came to shove they were not quite as cast iron as we were led to believe. Given that together with the obvious wish of Cameron to remain in the EU regardless of the results of his 'renegotiations' and the willingness of the other leaders to providing him with 'victories' and you wonder why the EU and Cameron are having such difficulties. Today Cameron has had to accept that government ministers will be allowed to campaign for exit. Some of the most senior ministers are likely to do so. These sceptics have often spoken out against the EU for years. On the other hand many of the leading pro EU advocates are those who have previously argued for some aspect of the EU which has turned out to be a disaster or have worked for an organisation that have been a direct beneficiary of EU funding. In short the anti's have far more credibility than the pro's. To re-emphasise the point, the idea of Jean Claude Juncker having any influence in the UK is laughable. This is the man who refused to campaign in the UK at all in the 2014 European Elections, refused to be interviewed by the BBC and is best known here for the quote "When it becomes serious, you have to lie" Finally, the EU has never sold the British public on the idea of a political union. A trade organisation by all means but no more. Obviously many on the continent do want more, but does anyone who knows the British actually believe there is any support at all for membership of a federal state here? German leaders have been absolutely clear "Please understand for us Europe is much more than a currency or a single market... It is a political union we want." Guido Westerwelle (then the German Foreign Minister) BBC 19/12/11. Or Hans-Peter Uhl (CDU and member of Council of Elders of the Bundestag) "We are not against Cameron but more against the whole attitude of England in its relationship with the EU. Britain wants a free trade union. We want a European state with a harmonised legal system. Now Britain has to decide Yes or No, In or Out." BBC 03/06/14. No one can believe for one moment that the UK would vote for this. Even if Cameron wins his referendum, he is not winning UK approval for membership of a federal state, he is simply winning acceptance of the current status together with all our current opt outs. Hanging over it all is the statutory requirement for additional referenda if ever a future government wants to hand over significant new powers to the EU, courtesy of the European Union Act 2011.

You will miss us when we are gone
andrew_ellis 01/05/2016
I voted to remain in the Common Market in 1975 and will vote to leave in the referendum. The EU has become an undemocratic tyranny of the self-electing elites who despise Britain and envy our history, military might and current economic success. The treatment of our Prime Minister over the election of Junckers was despicable and so-called allies Merkel and Rutte should be ashamed of themselves by appointing a man who is patently unfit for office. The current negotiations are a fig leaf and will not change the onward rush towards a European Superstae because the Europeans cannot be trusted to play fair with Britain. Goodbye and good luck but please don't look to us to save you from yourselves as we did in the 19th and twice in the 20th century - we have expended too much blood and treasure already. [Umor britanic]

Brexit
haiginio 01/06/2016
Britain, along with Germany, is one of the two top lapdog countries in EU and, needless to say, the masters across the Atlantic want her to stay in the club. They can have rivalries against one another in football matches, commonly referred as the " Battle of Britain" in the mainstream media, but under no circumstances should they be allowed to put their national or continental priorities ahead of their master's priorities.

Let the UK Leave
jack.kalpakian 01/06/2016
A Federal Europe is what is needed at this stage, meaning a fiscal and political union. There is absolutely no constituency for this in the UK today, and the sooner the UK leaves, the sooner it will be possible to construct a Federal State of Europe. The UK's departure will also hasten its eventual adhesion to Europe, albeit as Scotland, England and Wales.

From Social Democracy to Market Justice
TomMacFarlane 01/06/2016
This article confirms the extent to which the EU has lost sight of it's founding fathers, who were NOT drawn from the extreme individualism underpinning corporate America. The direct line from the banking crash of 1929 to the mass unemployment which led directly to World War II is a reminder that 'free' markets - of the type soon to be adopted under the terms of the TransAtlantic Trade & Investment Plan - will always cause the expanding inequalities which have followed the 2008 crash. If Brexit serves to remind the neoliberal clique now driving EU policy, of the disaster over which they are presiding so much the better. Whether it serves Britain's interests is an entirely different matter.

Leave
Vittumainen 01/06/2016
The article summarises well Britains mood for leaving, but not why such a scenario would be bad for EU. A break up means changes, painful, but not necessarily a bad thing. I hope that Merkel leaves the emotional strings to UK behind and not giving in for their black mail. After all UK is just dead weight. The argument that UK is helpful against Club Med is over played since Club Med these days means nothing. I believe that the necessary structural reforms EZ needs would be more swiftly implemented without UK.

http://www.spiegel.de/.../eu-seeks-to-avoid-brexit-at-all...Vezi traducerea

 

 

Brexit Danger: The EU Strategy to Keep Britain from Leaving - SPIEGEL ONLINE

SPIEGEL.DE|DE SPIEGEL ONLINE, HAMBURG, GERMANY

 

Prospectiv A-z .
continuare:

wilpost37 01/07/2016
An ever-closer union? Like a smothering embrace from Brussels bureaucrats with all their rules, regulations, and mandates, which are squashing/ignoring local cultures? How could Germany ever be comfortable with Greece or Italy or Moldova or Albania, and develop by the same rules? Such diversity in a household would be maddening and chaotic, which, in fact, has resulted from the EU "experiment". A loose association of nations should replace the EU. The idea of no borders and people, some legal, some illegal, freely moving around, willy nilly, is beyond rational. A nation should be free to join and free to leave, upon six month notice. It would be a lot more comfortable for all of them and likely more durable in the long run.

Consensus reached (at least here)
garyboblond 01/07/2016
After reading the comments here, there is little else to say, except confirm the views of most Brits who want the UK to pursue her future outside a moribund EU club (presided by a corrupt clique). This does not mean breaking up ties with the EU (there is no friendship between nations, only interests, and Germany proved this exemplarily when Merkel did not hesitate to kill Greece - for the next 3 generations). The UK will continue to be the second largest economy in Europe (surpassing Germany by 2030, per OECD), growing faster than any other nation, and it will continue to be the largest European buyer of German and French goods (outside those 2 countries, at least for a while), and goods of many other countries. The UK is a good EU customer and must use its very considerable commercial muscle to ensure the EU is fair in its reciprocation. The biggest benefit of all, with the UK outside the EU it will be much easier to identify the real causes of the problems, rather than simply accusing the UK of being the culprit, as exemplified by the endless crises (migrants, Euro etc) which are about to kill the EU dream (Italy, Spain, Portugal, Greece, France, Ireland) despite the UK not being part of Schengen or the Euro (if the UK were in, no doubt the blame would be on us). It is debatable how long it will be before Germany causes, yet, another war in the Continent (Merkel's recent acts suggest not very long to wait) and perhaps the UK this time should be less keen to sacrifice its sons and daughters to clean up the mess.

Advantage institutions
eppingblogger 01/07/2016
Despite leading this article by describing how the institutions of the EU are to be used to assist Cameron in getting the result he wants from any referendum it goes on to suggest that the pro-integration side are at a disadvantage. Perhaps the author does not know that British tax payers money has been spent and continues to be spent supporting Cameron's position. Far from being at a disadvantage the state media organisation, the BBC, and big business have been busy advancing the case for continued membership. They falsely represent that as the status quo, whereas in fact it would mean further political integration, additional ill judged regulation and further loss of democracy. The Corporation of the City of London, an elected body dealing with local government in the Square Mile, has assisted in running pro-EU seminars and regular puts forward articles in the Pro-EU CityAM newspaper; most recently the Lord Mayor of London wrote accordingly. Clearly this is an abuse of funds designed to run the City and an abuse of their position. It was particularly hilarious that Spiegel complained that business people who support Brexit "had largely been unknown until now" - presumably that means they have been running private businesses instead of crooning with politicians.

Cry Freedom for Britain
peter_smith 01/07/2016
Charles de Gaulle said it clearly back in the 60's "Britain does not belong in the European project," but neither British nor European politicians took any notice. We only made that first application because the US President told Harold MacMillan to do it, and the French President was correct - we don't belong in this new German Empire - the nascent 4th Reich. People here see the EU as a vast hole into which we pour £55million per day and all we get in return are rules and regulations and interference with our courts and laws and now the Germans, who invited 100 million Muslims into Europe, want to use that as an excuse to impose a border force on us all. Even Hitler never thought of that! Cry Freedom for Britain

 

Prospectiv A-z  .
continuare:

Brexit
gibson.ag 01/08/2016
The campaign to keep the UK in the EU is foundering because they can offer no positives to the great majority of people in the UK. Free travel v. using a passport? Hardly the end of the world when you HAVE to use an airport or the tunnel. Defence? That's NATO's job. Immigration? Merkel should be in jail. I'm struggling to find anything positive AT ALL about our membership. If the UK kept its money, rather than giving it to the EU, we could reduce our budget deficit to a large extent. Hard to justify our government borrowing money, which I'll have to pay back, in order to build nice roads in Croatia and Romania.

graham_brlw 01/09/2016
The fundemental problem with Britain and the EU is that the Politicians always told the public it was a trading arrangement. An EU super state was never mentioned,and Brussels is seen as a corrupt, undemocratic bunch of apparatchiks who dictate to the |British and take their assets and take no notice of what Britain wants. The point of no return has already been reached. No border controls, Mass unfettered immigration ,which will inevitably head for Britain including Turkey. Endless expense which Britain never recovers. Britain knows how to trade world wide, and the EU had better get used to dealing and trading with an independant for richer or poorer Britain, but utterly independent. We will not live in a dictatorship.

Brexit Danger
stephen_thomas 01/09/2016
I voted 'yes' in 1975 to membership of the EEC and will vote 'yes' again to remain within the EU should Cameron put his referendum forward in 2016 or 2017. Membership has been of huge benefit to my country, Wales, and to the people of Scotland and Northern Ireland. It will be interesting to see the breakdown of any referendum result by constituent nation of the UK, something Cameron's government will resist. Should the English vote tip the balance into 'no' territory, because of the size of their population compared to Wales, Scotland and Northern Ireland, I predict an early end to any idea of a continued 'United Kingdom'. The Conservative Party is a minority party in all four nations apart from England. Cameron, I really believe, cares more about keeping his party together than he does about anything else and certainly more than he cares about Wales, Scotland and Northern Ireland. Bring it on, Mr Cameron.

An interesting comparison: Australia and New Zealand
spon-facebook-1325787534 01/10/2016
As an economist who was long a proponent of an Australasian Union between Australia and New Zealand [two quite extraordinarily compatible countries in the great scheme of things] I have changed my mind. Pursuing 'free' trade agreements has given NZ plenty of opportunities recently while reserving its right to dissent and follow its own social policies. Countries such as the UK and NZ will be desirable trade partners for many decades to come - and as such, they will continue to be courted. On the other hand, the USA is a very large country that is more divided politically than at any time since the Civil War - and an increasingly poor model for the EU. Reorienting the wider EU as primarily a free trade area makes best sense. This would leave the Schengen countries to pursue 'ever closer union' - if their national politics will allow it.

joan_brown 01/12/2016
too interested in finance and not the overall good of the country. We are ruled by greedy politicians feathering their own nests. [EXACT!]

Brexit
Wetoldyouso 01/12/2016
The British are fools if they do not take this opportunity to leave. However, I doubt they will: the TTIP and Big Business cabal will scare them enough so that they vote to REMAIN. [EXACT!]Vezi traducerea

Mihai Ion Turcu Intre statele UE exista diferente, discrepante si interese, organixew care nu pot fi depasite de azi pe maine, pot fi armonizate in timp prin evilutii convergente in cadrul unei Confederatii de state suverane in consens asupra catorva elemente de structura si strategii lka care se pot adauga pe masura consolidarii uniunii altele. Poriectul UE depaseste politica curenta a unor partide, guverne, este un proiect realizabil in generatii.