Polonezii, Rusia, istoria..- 5 noiembrie 2014
Prospectiv FCh In primul rand, polacul se joaca de-a istoria cand spune ca " în 1914, când rușii au luat parte la provocarea Primului Război Mondial." Sursa porcariei dela 1914 trebuie cautata intai peste Canalul Manecii. In al doilea rand, daca Vestul greseste in calcule si/sau daca si de data asta cuvantul vesticilor valoreaza la fel ca alte garantii de securitate din ajun de alte Razboaie, castanele ruso-(germane?) vor cadea iarasi in capul polonezilor.
Ma intreb ce legatura au aceste tensiuni cu faptul ca lumea e condusa de prima generatie care n-a mai jucat submarine pe hartie cu patratele, ci pe calculator.Putin și-a ales singur rolul de lider al unui stat umilit, în locul cooperării (ministru polonez)
Președintele Rusiei, Vladimir Putin, și-a ales singur rolul de
lider al unui stat umilit, în pofida numeroaselor propuneri de cooperare din
partea țărilor occidentale, a declarat ministrul polonez de externe Grzegorz
Schetyna pentru cotidianul Gazeta Wyborcza, citat de agenția de presă
ucraineană Unian.
"Președintele Putin, în cuvintele căruia se întrevede dorul după
împărțirea bipolară a lumii, pare sincer. Dar el și-a ales singur rolul de
lider al unui stat umilit, care vrea să se ridice din genunchi", a afirmat
șeful diplomației poloneze, potrivit căruia Rusia duce o "politică
agresivă de vecinătate" și vrea să creeze un așa-numit cordon de
securitate în jurul frontierelor sale din state pe care să le controleze. "Aceasta însă nu corespunde deloc situației secolului XXI, pentru că, în realitate, nimeni nu vrea să umilească Rusia. A existat un număr uriaș de propuneri dinspre Occident la adresa Moscovei în ultimii 25 de ani", a subliniat Schetyna, amintind de oferta de asistență financiară făcută primului președintelui al Rusiei de după comunism, Boris Elțin, de invitația făcută Moscovei de a lua parte la politica europeană Parteneriatul Estic sau de crearea unor programe de cooperare strategică între Rusia și UE, care acum sunt în discuție.
Rusia, a spus ministrul polonez de externe, este o mare putere, care ar trebui să-și regândească rolul în lume și să conștientizeze că ne aflăm în 2014, nu în 1914, când rușii au luat parte la provocarea Primului Război Mondial.
"Cu o sută de ani în urmă, Rusia țaristă se simțea bine când a intrat în război, dar a terminat prost. Astăzi trebuie să realizăm că nu se poate reveni la lumea bipolară. Și chiar dacă se va reveni pentru un timp, atunci — aș îndrăzni o teză — fără participarea Rusiei, pentru că există alți candidați la acest rol", a declarat ministrul polonez de externe, citat de Unian.
AGERPRES/
Alexandru Cosmin Codreanu Dezamăgitoare reacția Ministrului de Externe polonez. La
fel cum România este asemeni unui pechinez care latră ursul și speră ca acesta
să aibă alte priorități în afară de a-i da o labă, dl. Grzegorz Schetyna începe
să-i dea sfaturi lui Putin.
Ca o persoană care a lucrat cu polonezi timp de 9 ani, știu că aceștia privesc cu vigilență maxima granița de est a Poloniei. Însă mai știu că polonezi sunt caracterizați de tact și pragmatism. Această ieșire a Ministrului de Externe al Poloniei nu mi se pare deloc constructivă.
Ca o persoană care a lucrat cu polonezi timp de 9 ani, știu că aceștia privesc cu vigilență maxima granița de est a Poloniei. Însă mai știu că polonezi sunt caracterizați de tact și pragmatism. Această ieșire a Ministrului de Externe al Poloniei nu mi se pare deloc constructivă.
Prospectiv FCh .Dupa ce au fost
clonate oile, s-a trecut la clonarea basestilor-baci.
A.C.C Ca
să le dăm polonezilor ce este al lor, armata lor stă mult mai bine decât a
noastră. Cu toate astea o astfel de ieșire la nivel de Ministru de Externe nu
se justifică
Draghi Puterity Eu am avut o cu
totul alta perceptie. Putin a incercat din greu sa joace dupa regulile
occidentale si sa coopereze cu occidentul (exemplu tipic razboiul impotriva
terorismului - de fapt a unei insurgente islamice mondiale). Abia cand a
devenit evident ca occidentul triseaza masiv in defavoarea Rusiei a schimbat
placa.
P.FCh John Mearsheimer si cativa
altii cam spun acelasi lucru, Draghi, inclusiv faptul ca s-a promis rusilor
neavansul NATO catre est...
Cat mai valoreaza cuvantul Vestului scris pe vreo
hartie? Ori, cand asta se intampla, pierdem astfel sansa oricarei rezolvari
mediate/negociate.
Gheorghe Gradinaru partea a 2a At the same time, covering the elections,
focusing public attention on what is happening in the Donbas, Moscow cleverly
pushes the matter Crimea beyond the pale of discussion. Today the public is
interested in the Donbas and Crimea is in the shade, which can not be consent.
Symbolic that on the peninsula did not mention President Barack Obama during a
September speech at the United Nations. Russia is testing us, how far it can
go. The same was in the 70s or 60s in Afghanistan during the Cuban missile
crisis. President Vladimir Putin, with the words lurks a longing for the
bipolar division of the world, seems to be this honest. Cast himself in the
role of leader humiliated powers that want to get up from his knees. Russia
clearly wants to create a security belt around its borders - kind of states,
which will have a direct impact. This leads what might be called
"aggressive Neighbourhood Policy". But it is not completely congruent
with the situation in the twenty-first century., Because nobody wanted to
humiliate Russia. Number of bids led by the West to Moscow in the last 25 years
has been enormous. Starting with financial assistance in times of Yeltsin, by
invitation of the Eastern Partnership, the creation of EU-Russia Partnership
for Modernisation or strategic partnership with Brussels, which today is the
big question. Where in all this is Poland? President Bronislaw Komorowski
admits that Europe is to us a little regret is that we enlisted her to
"Wild Field" in the region, which does not understand and does not
know. - The situation in Ukraine showed that if Europe will not be able to define
the problem and properly deal with it, then the problem will come to Europe.
Russia had yet another way, at one time proposed to her very generous offer:
for ridding the imperial ambitions of cooperation with Europe, running a
business. It was the Germans said that democracy can be introduced through
gazociągom, industrial investments and the interrelation of trade. And today
already know how Moscow responds to the softness and lability. Polish success
is the solidarity policy regarding the East. When the last Foreign Affairs
Council in Luxembourg discussed the point: "Review of sanctions against
Russia", the ministers said in one voice: There is nothing to discuss.
There are no conditions to endure sanctions against Russia. It was the voice of
all the ministers, even those who have recently had a different opinion. We all
agree that the sanctions must be hard to give results. The treatment of Europe
by Russia must be met with the response, it is also a matter of our respect for
themselves, authority and decency. These sentiments appeared especially after
the October meeting of the Europe - Asia in Milan. Demonstration late President
of Russia has become a symbol of his relationship to Europe. The whole world
saw it - even those who said they need to talk with Russia at all costs, to
seek channels of communication to reach out. It mainly they could be offended.
It does not absolve us from trying to balance Eastern policy. The question is
whether the Ukrainians were aware that their accession to Europe, which was the
Polish ambassador, will launch a flurry of events, with the annexation of the
Crimea, Donetsk secession and war. - That's not my pacyfikowaliśmy students at
the end of last year on the Maidan, nor we are in the last the moment we pulled
up to the signing of an association agreement with the EU, contrary to
expectations of a significant part of the population. It's inconsiderate
behavior of President Viktor Yanukovych - which on the one hand, Europe
promised signing of the Association Agreement, on the other liquidating
peaceful protests - launched an avalanche. Yanukovych wanted to fool everyone,
and most own nation. We, I mean Polish politics, every time we did the same
thing, considering the first independence of Ukraine, supporting the Orange
Revolution, and then the Maidan. We want a sovereign, strong, democratic
Ukraine, who realizes his dream of his own subjectivity and Europeanism.
Support in the implementation of the Ukrainian dream was not against anyone,
for example, against Russia. We are open for cooperation with Russia. I did not
then and still do not have the impression that through the support of Russia,
Ukraine, Poland wanted to harm to Russia push, pick up her sphere of influence.
On the contrary, we stressed that we are the best possible relations with
Moscow, Kiev. In contrast, no one has the right to restrict or impose lifestyle
choices Ukrainians, just as we do not want anyone to impose them to us. On the
one hand you are talking about the success, which is a common policy towards
Ukraine and Russia. On the other - you declared that Poland will be in Milan to
participate in talks on Ukraine, which has not happened. - In Milan there was
no serious talk about Ukraine, because there was no will, and above all on one
side. I believe that any serious conversation about the future of Ukraine and
seek serious answers, how to end the conflict must take place with our
presence. Speak no Polish of Ukraine, it is as if in the cases of Libya,
Algeria, Tunisia, Morocco, speak no Italian, French, Spanish. Or maybe, says
President Komorowski, Ukrainians do not want us at the table, because I think a
conversation with Polish participation to be ineffective? A truce in Minsk
partially stopped the fight in the East. - Talks in Minsk took place with the
participation of the OSCE and the European Union, and the direct cause was the
military defeat of Ukraine to the Russian war machine. Ukrainian problems is
best handled in a format Weimar - Poland, Germany, France - because we have the
most knowledge and the most experience. What was the result of talks with the
format Normandy (Germany, France, Russia, Ukraine)? In August in Berlin, little
was found in Milan attempted to "oxygenate" the system involving the
Italians and the British. But it did not. The participants themselves this
formula say it is ineffective. From the point of view of political efficacy is
best coped in February Laurent Fabius and Frank-Walter Steinmeier, who,
encouraged by Radoslaw Sikorski came to Kiev and negotiated an agreement between
the government and the opposition. They managed to end the bloodshed, while
snipers were firing from an acute weapons to unarmed demonstrators. Stopped the
tragedy on a much larger scale, because Yanukovych situation got out of
control. It was the biggest success of the West in Ukraine this year. What is
now most important in Ukrainian-Russian relations? - It sounds paradoxical,
because we want to go to a world without borders, but Ukrainians should
establish a border with Russia accepted by both parties. Something that can
patrol and control in real terms. If the boundary is smooth, and in fact it is
not, it can change everything by force. What for Polish foreign policy is
Russia an enemy, opponent, rival, enemy? - Russia is a big country that needs to
redefine its role. Realize that it is now 2014, not 1914, when Russia took part
in the unleashing of World War I after the assassination Gawriły Princip in
Sarajevo. One hundred years ago, Tsarist Russia was feeling good, joining the
war, but went to the wrong. Today should realize that it will not return to a
bipolar world. And if ever comes a time that - I will venture the thesis -
without the participation of Russia, because there are other candidates for the
role."
De asemenea declaratia "belicoasa" a min de externe polonez trebuie pusa si in contextul in care acesta succede lui Sikorski( cunoscut cu opinii proamericane si puternic implicat in evolutia situatiei din Ucraina) sens in care , in opinia mea, acesta a supralicitat subiectul cu scop strict de PR.
De asemenea declaratia "belicoasa" a min de externe polonez trebuie pusa si in contextul in care acesta succede lui Sikorski( cunoscut cu opinii proamericane si puternic implicat in evolutia situatiei din Ucraina) sens in care , in opinia mea, acesta a supralicitat subiectul cu scop strict de PR.
G.G partea 1a Articolul
din Agerpres preia o stire din sursa ucrainiana Union care citeaza un interviu
din ziarul polonez "Gazeta Wyborcza" iata Gheorghe Gradinaru (translatia prin bing a interviului )
:"PAUL WROŃSKI: Six months ago, the then Foreign Minister Radoslaw Sikorski said that Europe was in the greatest crisis since the collapse of communism. Then Russia annexed the Crimea without a fight, no one has ever shot. How do you as the new head of the Ministry of Foreign Affairs defines the situation now?
SCHETYNA GREGORY: We have seen that it was a prelude to more serious story. In the spring there was no open war in the east of Ukraine in Donetsk and Lugansk. Scenarios that Russia might want to lead the expansion at the expense of neighbors, were dealt with, but it seemed to be the most radical. Today we know that we have to reckon seriously with them. Just to the south. Even six months ago, such a construction as the Islamic State and its recent progress seemed hard to imagine. Today, the symbol of this brutal war, the situation in the suburbs Koban. NATO must confront threats to flank the east and south. We are located between the two inflammatory regions. Europe is surrounded on the east and south crescent of instability. All this took place before the September summit of the North Atlantic Alliance and certainly influenced his behavior. Now determine the Heads of State and Government and diplomats need to bring to life over which we work vigorously. There also imagined that there will be elections in the Donetsk and Lugansk last Sunday. - There are better and worse performances. It happens to be quite nieśmieszne. Shows dangerous phenomenon. Crimea, or the annexation of territory without a single shot, he was something special. The situation in the eastern Ukraine confirms that it does not hesitate to use force, including large-scale, because the eastern Ukraine were involved in a total of tens of thousands of Russian soldiers with heavy equipment.
:"PAUL WROŃSKI: Six months ago, the then Foreign Minister Radoslaw Sikorski said that Europe was in the greatest crisis since the collapse of communism. Then Russia annexed the Crimea without a fight, no one has ever shot. How do you as the new head of the Ministry of Foreign Affairs defines the situation now?
SCHETYNA GREGORY: We have seen that it was a prelude to more serious story. In the spring there was no open war in the east of Ukraine in Donetsk and Lugansk. Scenarios that Russia might want to lead the expansion at the expense of neighbors, were dealt with, but it seemed to be the most radical. Today we know that we have to reckon seriously with them. Just to the south. Even six months ago, such a construction as the Islamic State and its recent progress seemed hard to imagine. Today, the symbol of this brutal war, the situation in the suburbs Koban. NATO must confront threats to flank the east and south. We are located between the two inflammatory regions. Europe is surrounded on the east and south crescent of instability. All this took place before the September summit of the North Atlantic Alliance and certainly influenced his behavior. Now determine the Heads of State and Government and diplomats need to bring to life over which we work vigorously. There also imagined that there will be elections in the Donetsk and Lugansk last Sunday. - There are better and worse performances. It happens to be quite nieśmieszne. Shows dangerous phenomenon. Crimea, or the annexation of territory without a single shot, he was something special. The situation in the eastern Ukraine confirms that it does not hesitate to use force, including large-scale, because the eastern Ukraine were involved in a total of tens of thousands of Russian soldiers with heavy equipment.
A.C.C @
dl. Gheorghe Gradinaru
Evident, când avem pe masă tot textul, mesajul sună cu totul altfel, aș spune chiar tipic polonez . Mulțumim pentru că nu ne-ați lăsat doar pe mâna Agerpres.
Poland Prepares For Russian 'Confrontation' In New Defense
Strategy
Evident, când avem pe masă tot textul, mesajul sună cu totul altfel, aș spune chiar tipic polonez . Mulțumim pentru că nu ne-ați lăsat doar pe mâna Agerpres.
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